IQ Meets EQ Podcast

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Ep84 Living life on your terms

by Jacqui Brauman
November 17th 2021

Jacqui and Ush reflect after another woman who has navigated a successful career, through masculine workplaces, towards working for herself in a truly impactful way. Melissa has over 20 years’ expe... More

Welcome to the I Q VQ podcast. I'm Jackie brahman, principal solicitor at Tv A law and Ceo of legally wise women and I'm here as always with static former corporate lawyer then head of HR and now an emotional intelligence coach. Good evening. Hey Jackie. We were just saying, right, how are we recording on a sunday night as opposed to Tuesday early mornings. So strange. It is very different. Good change is good. It is, it is the energy is very different though. Like it's, I was thinking about it, you know, an hour or so ago coming up to the call. I was like, I'm actually really exhausted and but I'm not sure if that's a general sunday thing or because it's sort of this time of the year as well. Are you starting to get tired this time of the year? No, I'm actually all right at the moment I'm sort of in that mode, which is where I always have been doing that sprint towards christmas because I do my planning in september, I'm sort of like super focused and I actually do work one day of the weekend between now and christmas so it's almost, but it's on, on the business, not in the business.

So it's just sort of my, my sort of planning phase at the moment, it was a work day for me the day off. Yeah, because we've been locked down so much. I have sort of worked most weekends, all year. The last two weekends. I've not worked all weekend, but sort of done a bit of work and then packed in a whole lot of stuff because we could do things and this weekend I went away with a couple of girlfriends and I am just exhausted. That's probably why it's because you've crammed all of the activities plus the work. And also don't you realize if you hadn't been a time out with your mates or whatever because we're on the go, we don't realize how tired we are until we stopped. So I think probably because you've had that little bit of a, I'm going to hang out with my mates. All of that has just come over. You haven't, perhaps that's right. A bit embarrassingly. When I was hanging out with them yesterday afternoon, I went to sleep for an hour. That's okay though. That's good. I know they were fine with it.

What a strange thing to do. Huh? I had a nana nap today as well and I don't normally nap in the day. But it was just like because of the puppy training and she's fully trained now. She's sleeping through the whole night, which is great. She goes to bed at about nine ish and she wakes up at five. So yes, but it's a good time. Yes. I was a little bit tired today. So I had like a 30 minute power nap on the sofa, but it was great. It was so nice. Good. Good. We've had this crazy weather the last couple of days as well. You've had lots of rain up there too, haven't you? We have, yes, it's literally and we had thunderstorms and all sorts. I'm hoping next week for a little bit better. But I actually don't mind it coming up to christmas, it reminds me of the UK because I still can't get my head around christmas when it's hot, mm hmm. It feels very strange having it so cold this time of year. And you know, we were talking about climate change a couple of episodes ago and we're full on into it really. I know, I know, and I just ordered um christmas bedsheets this evening. Ah that's what I was doing, waiting for you to have your dinner.

Oh well there you go, that's productive time. Business bedsheets. Very good. So this week I spoke to a lovely lady that I'm in a group with Melissa. Ma Melissa's had 20 years experience again in the financial services industry. She was originally a financial planner, but then she moved over as a stockbroker and then she moved into like financial education and seminar delivery. So she went from small boutique financial planning firms to then big institutions and finished up with Suncorp son Super. And a couple of those big places. But with all the ins and outs, she decided finally that she wanted to actually help people and that education stuff was where she's shown the most and so she's set up her own money mindset business called Talking money and yeah, I think that particularly at the early stage of her career is quite interesting to listen to and I think even she had some insights when she was talking to me about it, so let's have a listen.

Hi and welcome to the podcast, how are you? Good, good. How are you? Thanks for having me. Yeah, I'm excited. I'm excited to get to know you deeper because we're in a great little group and this should be fun. So we don't know where to take the week off. We started talking, I'm like hold on, we need to record this when you were growing up, What did you want to be? Well, I was just saying to you, I was trying to start walking this morning, I think I think I wanted to, well, you know, you sort of reflect whether it was what you which you can lead on to a lot of our other conversations what you were being told that you think you should be and actually what you think or what you actually wanted to be. So, I think there was a fairly strong suggestion in inverted commas, in my family to do nursing or something like that, which obviously absolutely nothing wrong with nursing and stuff like that. So I was just trying to reflect on how I jumped from perhaps nursing as an option to begin doing a commerce degree, which is obviously you couldn't get anything more extra and I think what, you know in other states changed before I got a I got caught up in a relationship and all sorts of stuff in Grade 11 and 12.

So my I didn't get a particularly good school which limited options available to me. So I think that's probably something that did have an impact because I can remember Stephen applying for Australian catholic university and stuff for nursing. So I think that was still a, you know that was that was obviously an option but I don't think my school allowed me university so that was sort of. Yeah well maybe thankfully. Well yes. Yes and then and then and then the option came up to go and do some study at a private place for the first year and then obviously it was in conjunction to the U. S. Q. And tumor grew up in Toowoomba. And then obviously if you passed you had to do some extra subjects and if you pass those subjects you're automatically accepted in a second here into us. Q. Yes. That was really interesting and it was actually the time before they were transitioning from you know being a college to a university. So I actually started out doing a business degree. I think it was a business degree in banking and they're majoring in banking and finance and stuff like that.

And then I actually left when I went over and sees lived overseas for a couple of years and by the time I came back that actually become a full blown uni. So I had the option then two upgradable commerce degree and I had to do, I had to do a couple of quotes. I had to do commerce law which was, I had to do another law subject and I had to do management accounting which was I think I just slipped through and try to accounting on the skill. Yes, it was it was an interesting transition of Yeah. Of what, you know, stunning. Very, It just sounds like sort of opportunities were presented and you just sort of landed a little bit. What sort of work were you doing while you were doing all this? So when I was actually used to manage a chinese restaurant, I managed to chinese restaurants in into managed three different restaurants with this guy actually or work for him. And then the last one I managed the restaurant for him. Which was interesting. It was a really good time management. Mm hmm skills because most of us were students. And so when exam times came, everyone else had run for the hills.

And so I actually, you know, a number of times I actually worked through my exams and stuff like that. So it was because there was no one else available. So I just had to do it and stuff. And so it was really, you know, it's like that old adage, you know if you want something done, give it to a busy person that was well and truly, I I think it was very, had to prioritize and you do a very good time management around working and you know, and studying everything as well. So it was interesting time and then I think I sort of, when I went overseas and stuff like that, I was actually a nanny, a nanny for, for a number of different families. So it was really, wasn't any, Yeah, wow, which countries were you doing that in? Just in London? So I'll do a bit of name, I can do some serious name dropping here. So you know, here, Laurie who's, who was in house, that's what I need for, wow, Long before he became a very big star, like he was just, you know, he was big, he was big because this is like 30 years ago now.

So it was, but yes, and he'd obviously been in the all the black ADDers and all those, all those productions and stuff in the UK. So yes, I met some very interesting people when I lived with them and very interesting people. Yeah. All right, so you come back to Australia, finish your degree then. What what is your career path? Like what did you do? Well, that was interesting actually. That was an interesting that something is funny when you start talking about this. So when I, before I went overseas I was not doing particularly well, had no really had no motivation to, to complete my subjects and something I'm not paying a very good picture for myself and my butt. It was it was actually when hex got introduced and I went and my lightning bolt came on one day that well I'm paying for these subjects and not even particularly mhm. Focused on Passing. So that's when I went you know what I probably have to go and have a have a break and have a think about things and I turned 21 and I went overseas and that's what I said when I came back to Australia.

It was it was it was like an anti funny enough and reflection of you know my family sort of question is commerce really what you you know you haven't done very well out of his commerce really what you want to do and blah blah blah. So I actually went back as a mature age student early twenties but still classified as a mature age student and 100% went back on my own volition, my own absolutely my own choice. And I went back and actually and you know I had to redo a couple of subjects and stuff like that but I got my G. P. A. Up so high that I actually was asked to do post grad study by the time I finished my degree like I sort of had yes I've had the extremes of university of just you know being a part time we're not really enjoying the social side of university and then coming back and actually, well attending university, which was made a big difference. So it was just, it was interesting. So I actually got my degree really completely with no pressure from it was actually opposite, you know, should I should I should actually do it or continue And so I'm going back into it was really, really interesting.

So I finished, I started off with a financial planning firm in Toowoomba, which was really, really interesting because it was very, very early days and they were very focused on FIFA Service, which was way, so this is 20 something years ago. So it was when all the lights when Telstra was floating and not just you know, when all the tabs and not just so they were very involved in self managed super funds direct shares. So it was all very, and so we looked after all their stuff and so it was very much FIFA service and it was, I was there first graduate that they had employed and and we all agreed and we left on very good terms and stuff like that, but employed female, a graduate that was female was probably not the really the best thing. So it's yes, yes, so it soon, it was just not, I decided to leave and move to Brisbane and become a stockbroker, but the fellow that replaced me fast tracked a lot more than quicker than I did. And got given clients and all that sort of stuff.

So it was it was interesting reflection of being in a smaller, smaller town, a female and finance and I can say this openly because they acknowledged it as well after It was like it was it was it was all acknowledged that perhaps it was, you know, that that was it was interesting. It was because I used to do a lot of the plans and it was before, you know, software tools. So we did all on Excel and it was usually the female clients that used to say to me because I was sort of classified as a client service manager and stuff like that. And they would say to me, you actually did this plan, didn't she? And I said, yeah. And I said And they said because you just know. So they acknowledged that I actually had written the plan as well. And not just it wasn't just implementing it. So it was it was interesting. Mm hmm. So that was a smaller business with male partners and Yeah. Mm hmm. Other females in that business, what would they primarily just for support or support? Yeah. So I was the first like I came in as a client services role but you know, I was came in as a graduate and with the thing either to be, you know, to progress Yeah.

And stuff like that. So I didn't. But the fellow after me. Yeah. But as you said, you were also their first trial at a graduate as well, let alone being female too. So they didn't exactly the gender issue very well, but maybe they learned a lot from you just taking on a grad as well. Exactly. And look, there was no, there was there was no, no hard feelings. I mean it was all just, but it was just, it was interesting what happened sort of more after I left. Yeah, yeah. And the guy that took me, it was delightful and so it was, it was all good and I moved to Brisbane anyway, so yeah, okay, so you moved to Brisbane and you became a stockbroker, is that right? Yes, yes. So I was a stockbroker for four years and ended up being in the tech boom, which was just like crazy. Yeah. Yeah, it was huge. It was, yeah, it was like a very, very crazy hedy times. So I worked for one company for for a while and you know if you want to head fly head on into male.

Yes. Well another one, yes. Well this was when I was the only female advisor and it was, you know it's one of those things in hindsight, I can't believe I was actually accepted, accepted being treated the way I've been treated and stuff like that. But you know, you you hear hear it's male dominated, its you know its stockbroking, I had no I had no experience, I didn't have a client base. So I was in what they call the clients wholesale broking team. So we actually serviced financial planners. So that was sort of how I got my role for my financial planning background and stuff like that. But it was just it was it was horrific. It was absolutely horrific. Mhm. Yeah I can imagine the pace of it, the people running on adrenaline and egos and things like that and then I was going to actually leave and then I was friends with someone else that introduced me to a recruiter and he actually found me. Another role is another firm that was delightful and still a lot of males, a lot of egos but there was a couple of other female advisors there so I moved and it was just it was like a it was amazing.

Yeah good. And so finally have some females in your life that are doing something similar to you and you can yes they can do it. Yes. Yeah. Yeah there was yeah there was not just as support staff but it was yeah there was two other female advisors. There's someone who's still she was still an advisor actually but it was just it was a different I mean there was still a huge egos and very male focused and all that sort of stuff but there were females actually you know being advisers and stuff like that so. Yeah. Okay good. So you sort of finally find your feet and find somewhere where you can where you can be, did you then sort of stay in the financial planning space for a large portion of your career? Because there's been so many changes in that industry to Yes, so I was not financial planning breaking. I was actually purely just 100 broking. I was actually I did a lot of options trading actually, that's what, that was sort of an area that I did a lot of trading. A lot of options trading clients. And then I I actually missed financial planning.

I really missed the whole yeah. You know, I think I was the only stockbroker that actually meant clients, like I used to make sure it's all done over the phone and stuff like that. So I decided to leave financial broking and I went back into financial planning in the bank's two different banks and it was Suncorp. And then, sorry, Westpac, then Suncorp and yes, so I sold my soul to the devil in the banking banking or in hindsight, But I mean, at the time he took the jobs, that was the way to go, wasn't it, really? Yeah, it was going back into planning and getting back into Westpac, that amazing training, like, you know, we had, I think we went to, I went to Melbourne for two or 3 weeks just for, you know, for training? Mm So it was, it was a great, great supportive area to get to get back into the, into the industry and that sort of stuff, but once again thanks, I don't think I need to say much more. No, that's right.

And I mean that's why the whole industry has been turned upside down to Absolutely, Absolutely. And so I remember once sat down, I was thinking, I can't, I just remember thinking I'd sort of worked at Westpac for awhile and then I moved to to some called one of the big flagship branches in the mall, which was fantastic. And there was two advices, there was, it was great, but I remember thinking I can't having come from that FIFA service like that whole ethos or FIFA service and all that sort of stuff, which so I've never had any trouble charging planning fees or anything like that, but I mean obviously the whole banking and this is still, you know, this is a fair while ago as well and I was thinking, oh, I gotta go do something else, I've got to get out of this, you know, this environments and I didn't ever used by newspapers and everything anyway, I bought the paper that used to have to still have the careers guide, you know, this is going how long ago this is and yeah, I was just looking through the career scott and this ad it didn't say it was four and I just read it and I went, oh my goodness gracious, that just sounds exactly and ended up being some super, so it was a superannuation fund, you know, wholly focused on profit for members, like it was just and I got a job there as a senior financial plan, it was just amazing, like it was, it was just yeah, yeah, it was amazing.

So I was I was spent about seven years and I did go away and have two Children and come back, so I was going to say when did you fit that in? So well is it son? Super. So it's a bit debatable, how much time I actually spent at Sun Super and actually on maternity leave because I had fairly long maternity leave, so yes, start off as a senior financial planner there. So look after Brisbane, I looked after the Sunshine Coast in Toowoomba and was involved in a lot of speaking and seminars and stuff like that and then when I came back from maternity leave they introduced the member advice and that was the first phone based advice and I did a cameo role because I was actually already pregnant, so I did a cameo role and did six months there and then left and then I just had my maternity leave extended and someone one of the managers contacted me and they said you know you're perfect, you're your dream jobs come up, what do you do you want to put your had the ring which was a seminar delivery specialist, which was actually overseeing all the member seminars, it was coaching the guys to present was you know, doing the content and anyway, so I applied for it and, and and went back and I had to win a child very, very quickly having just extended my maternity leave and then went back and yeah, that was a fantastic role, I really love that, love that role.

Okay, so you can sort of see that you're moving much more than into the education space because you love teaching people and then teaching colleagues how to teach people well, Well, it's funny, you know, it's it's it's not until I stopped and left employment that I realized, I forgot not even done it, I've done a search for that son, super on workplace coaching, so I hadn't even hadn't even remembered until until I saw all these this big trail of breadcrumbs taking, bringing me to where I where I actually was, Yes, I left some super, I did, I did another six months, I got a job with an amazing financial planning firm in Brisbane, so you know, it was huge, the big pinup girl and it was like, you know, it was, it was, it was a really fantastic role after a couple of months I realized number one, I didn't want to be a financial planner anymore. And number two, I actually want to be employed, I was starting to have that realization that perhaps these things that kept happening to me, not non conformist, and being fairly rebellious and being trying to continue to be shoved in a box.

So I thought, you know, I started thinking, I think there's not going to be more to life than this. Yeah, Okay. So you've been self employed ever since? Yes. Yes. So I had to the man that I mean, the fellow that I worked for and we've been courting with each other for years and, you know, waiting for him to have space to bring me on. And so it was all, it was all very fantastic and amazing after and look at the six month mark, I had to sort of say, you know, we had to sort of say, well, this is this progressing or not? And so I had to have it. It's not, it's not you, it's me. And he was hugely supportive and he was the first person I went to with my business idea and actually said, you know, what do you think? So? Yes, October 2013 was the last time I was employed. And even though it was massive. Yeah. And you've gone from planning into education and coaching. And also, in that time, my marriage had ended.

So I was actually raising two very, very small Children on my own. So that was just throw that next. So what, what do you do when you're in that situation, you leave employment and you start you start your own business? I mean you knew how to make money, didn't you? So yes, and I was in a very I was in a very fortunate position where actually I did perceive I love some so from somewhere and so that gave me the opportunity to actually, I think I already left was sort of think about that the other day though, I had already made the decision to leave employment, but then you know as things things turn up in your life and stuff like that. And so yeah, there was a amazing, I was given an amazing opportunity by my family to actually be in that position to Just just you know, 2014, I really sort of worked on developing my business focusing on my you know, looking after my care my Children who are still, it was very very young. So um yes, so it was it was, yeah, it was very good.

It was good, very fortuitous timing for me. Yeah. So what are you passionate about now? What do you do in your business and what keeps you going? I am just I'm passionate for people for money or stress or concern around money, particularly women because there's a whole space that women operate in with money and you know for a myriad of different reasons, but for it not to hold them back, it's not to keep them small or keep them feeling disempowered or not being able to actually live life on their terms or actually even be in the position to really understand what that means. So to have that have that freedom and choice in their lives and for money. For whatever reason for that to be a a sticking point for them to stop them from doing that. So, it's actually about unpacking that for people and shining a lot of it because a lot of times it's just because it's it's fear and avoidance. Mm hmm. That what's what's happening or as I said, you know, there's lots of different levels that that can be that that can be happening.

But it's just Yeah, because I've experienced it myself. I mean obviously got lots and lots of experience as you probably would have read the bio and stuff like that. Lots of letters after my name and everything. But the thing is as well as that I've experienced in the marriage in a relationship breakdown. I experienced it very much when I first started my business up because you know nothing like starting your own business to trigger the absolute every belief you have about everything particularly around money because you can't hide behind a role or a job title or a salary or whatever, particularly when you're when you're selling yourself as a coach, you're not selling widgets I was selling myself. So that's my my knowing now is that that's when the real growth and development actually had started happening for me, because I had to there's nothing like starting your own business to dive you into like, the personal development spaces. Well, exactly, because it got to the point for me that, you know, if I didn't sort out what was going on, I would have, I would my businessmen have being sustainable, so that's, you know, it was a and you know, obviously I could have gone back into, you know, I mean, I could have gone back into financial planning and stuff like that, but it's just just so so I didn't want to, sorry, go back into him being employed, actually, sorry, it didn't matter, it wouldn't matter what that was, it would have been, it was about being employed and yeah, being self employed gives you so many opportunities, or at least from the outside looking in you believe that it gives you so much more freedom.

But I suppose you see a lot of women who jumped to self employment and then just sort of take the same issues with them and adjust as bound up, trapped as they were as an employee as well. Yeah, there's a lot of support women around a lot of letting go or shedding our identities and that one. And you mean, once again, I did something I really experienced as well, and it's supporting a couple of clients at the moment that are actually transitioning out of corporate into their own space and it's actually really having to shed or let go of that identity because a lot of them, I mean, these women in their forties, they've had a lifetime of corporate, very masculine, you know, suffering a lot of them suffered burnout. So I put them in what we call their incubation period where they actually have to do nothing except for look after themselves. Yeah, yeah. It's all about self care and looking after themselves and obviously that, you know, you need to be in that position to be able to do that, you know, financially and all that sort of thing.

But it's, you know, from one of my clients, it's been amazing because she's in Melbourne. So she's actually, last year she was having to have a very high up job and home school her two young boys and everything and now this she left halfway through this year and now she's had that experience, the completely opposite experience of actually being available at home to home school. Yeah. So it's just, it's like chalk and cheese for her and it's been really, you know, it's still challenging but a very, very different experience. And also through that is shedding and having that realization of not bringing those identities that are not serving us or need to be really questions let go and everything from that corporate career and presence and stuff like that actually to not bring that into your into your business. It's all, you know, for women that leave relationships, it's the same, you know, it can be anything, any transitioning period to actually read it and it's So this thought for years, it's not about reinventing yourself because these women don't need to be reinvented.

Absolutes, amazing because they are amazing women. They need to rediscover their true self. It's more about, it's about rediscovering as you were saying that I was thinking it's a shedding off because it comes back to actually who you are and not what everyone else has told you to be or everyone else has expected you to be exactly which is around this identity thing and, you know, it's not it's not right or wrong or good or bad. It's just, it's just how we operate and how we're builders as, you know, so we can, you know, it could be a corporate identity, it could be as a partner, as a mother, as a friend, as a daughter or whatever that is, it's just making sure that that's not impacting how you're living your life and you're referring to this living life on your terms, but making sure that you actually really understand what that means for you and a lot of times that is that it's presenting itself in our relationship with money. Yeah, pretty deep, isn't it? How many sort of, is at the root of a lot or can be, can bring it up or you get to it through that way and it's so funny and I've sort of been saying this all all the years in my business, but it's actually coming to fruition now that I've been saying I come in on the money.

But it's never just about it's never about the money and actually that is actually starting to happen. We're sort of you know, so it's moving into that biggest space because women are wanting more support when we clear that, when I clear it with the money side of things like, okay, well what are we, what are we doing now? It's always said that your money is the effect not the cause mm hmm. Mhm. And so it's actually it's and it's because out, you know, our whole persona is so inextricably entwined with our relationship with money and it's you know, it's so much to do with our upbringing around what was spoken about now, you know, in our core beliefs in programming. But also, you know, coupled with that the societal conditioning, particularly as women, you know, we may have been exposed not much. We have been exposed to just put it out there right now. We have been exposed to all our lives that we don't even really know, I speak to a lot of women that are so intelligent, so switched on and amazing at what they do and stuff like that.

And they've got this and this is pretty much this is not just women. It's it's meant as well as societies, they've got this such an embarrassment and shame around not knowing all about money. And I just said, well, has anyone ever taught you any of this? Do you actually, has anyone ever sat down and really torches? And they said no? And I said, well why do you feel like you've got this huge expectation that you should on yourself, that you should know all this stuff, which is one of the main reasons I actually started my business because you know, in all the different areas that I worked in finance and stuff like that, I would have these conversations with these people and there was so much, you know, there was a lot of embarrassment and shame around not being all over their money and their finances and their financial literacy and knowledge and understanding and stuff like that, which would then leave them, leave them onto because I want to make sure it's still look bright and shiny on the outside but would lead them to be making decisions that weren't serving them at all. And that's a pretty slippery slope when it comes to to money and that sort of thing.

And so I just kept seeing this and my whole motivation apart from my own personal reasons and it was to create a safe space to have a real conversation around money, not what you feel like it should look to the outside world or your family or society or whatever your show, you know, it's actually let's just actually really have a chat, what's going on here, because it's only then you're able to move forward. Yeah, Yeah, absolutely. And delving into it because yeah, if you leave at surface level, it's never going to be look at hmm, well, and, you know, you can go along okay, but it's it's just it's a game changer of actually sorting this stuff out, you know, for yourself, you know, three always always challenge people. If they're, you know, how money was spoken about when they were growing up, won't be showing up somewhere in their adult life. Either directly how they relate to money in their professional life or in their personal, in their personal relationships or, you know, for me, I, you know, I've got the trifecta or I've experienced all three, but it's it's it's if you can actually have that awareness, that understanding and stuff like that, it can it can have a massive, massive difference in your life and it has a huge as everyone knows when your money isn't great, it will have a huge flow on effect of how you're feeling and it'll seep into all different areas of your life.

It's the same of the opposite of that as well, if things, you know, how you're feeling about money, you're feeling empowered in control about money, you're communicating with your partner or whatever is going on, it has it elevates things hugely as well. Yeah, yeah, I can see that. So with everything that you know now if you went back and gave your 21 year old self some advice, what would that be? Don't just don't give your power away to anyone, particularly boys. It's not to be true to yourself, but just understand how amazing you are and what a gift you have got to share with the world. And don't don't dull your light for anyone. That's probably the main one is do not dial your light for anyone if they don't, if they don't accept you, if they don't accept you for who you are. which has sort of taken me to 50 to actually really own as you know, own that space and own who I am and own how I operate and speak and and that's good because that's actually exactly the women I actually want to attract and support and I look around, they are the ones that have attracted and I am supporting.

So it's like it's like the chicken or the egg. Yes. Don't don't dull your light for anyone. Mm hmm. Wonderful. Great. So for those who don't want to dull their light and want to work with you, how they get in contact. So I guess they can. However, whatever is easiest. I'm obviously on the social media platforms, I'm on linkedin. I'm on instagram. I've got a business and a personal facebook page. So you know, whatever people or through my website, they can book in two. I've got a link to book in for always just to have a chat, like a complimentary chat about where they're at and that sort of thing. So maybe if you could share my calendar link, but it's just, it's however people feel because, you know, it's a funny thing, people don't want to I don't want to talk about it or they don't want other people to know that they're talking about or whatever. So I'm always very respective and aware of, even in my area that I live in in Brisbane, I support quite a lot of women that no one never knows that being supported because it's some are open about and some are, but that's that's that's their business.

So I'm just, you know, it's always such an honor and a huge privilege to be for people to share that aspect of their life because it is probably one of the most emotive things and personal things is people's actual financial situation, particularly if it's not great. Yeah, I'm just very, always very respectful of that. So however, people feel comfortable contacting me. That's okay, wonderful, Great. And we will put all the links in the show notes and people can reach out to me as well if they want to get in touch directly. Thank you so much for your time. Mel it's been a wonderful chat and I'm so pleased to have dived into that a little bit deeper. No, thanks for having me. I was like, talk about stuff I haven't talked about for a long time. Wonderful. All right. We've got another financial one. What's the change you're going to make this time? I know I love the finance ones because it's such a you know, interesting topic for me. You know, when I said, I said this on our podcast before, when I've done sort of work on my own money story and you know, and she alluded to that a little bit in the podcast as well.

Right? That our, you know, money stories and paradise come up, whether it's in our relationships or businesses or work or friends and it's it's so true. And I love the you know, she was able to teach that and and really help women and I think, you know, just listening to her story, It's almost like pretty much every female that we've interviewed. They go through this path going, I think I'm going to go here and then they end up where their passion and purpose is. Which is just beautiful. And I think that really shown in this podcast as well in the interview that where she's landed is where she's meant to be. Yeah, very much so. And isn't that almost the journey of someone through their to their eq as well because they have to have had some insight and self awareness and worked out their values and worked out their strengths and how they want to actually work with people. So mm hmm. Yeah. Absolutely. And I think that education space is so important. Right. And I think she she really explained how she's able to hold that space and it's almost like a judgment free thing.

I do sometimes find that you know when we go and ask for help in this space that you do feel a bit charged, it's almost like what the hell? Why don't you know this ship, you're in your forties, You should know this. And I love how she explained that it's sort of that judgment free, you know, just support. We're not everyone's taught this from a young age and even hearing how she said that towards the end how discreet she is when people reach out because you know, people don't people in the community or around the person she's coaching don't necessarily know that they're that they're having the coaching or or learning or going through those sort of transformations. So I guess that is really important for some people to keep it quite private because of the shame, which is unnecessary. It is but it's just that again that goes back to your stories as well, doesn't it? You know, not you know how some people just don't talk about money. They're uncomfortable about it. They're asking for help is even harder. What about going all the way back to when she was just so uncertain as well as a teenager finishing school.

I thought that was really interesting for someone who has ended up so driven and like highly I guess competent and at the top of her field to be completely uncertain about what she was going to even do at the beginning. Hmm. Quite interesting. It is, but I think that's where you give yourself the space to think and grow, I almost think that's a really good position to be in. Whereas I know growing up I was pretty fixed on what I wanted to do, which sort of put blinkers on and didn't really allow me to explore other avenues because I was like so focused on the direction. But then when I got to that destination that I thought I didn't enjoy it and I was like sure I wish I had just actually allowed myself to not be so blinkered. Yeah, that's right, I think but at that age to even have the concept of being able to give yourself the time because and maybe it was a blessing that she had that turmoil and didn't get great mass because if she hadn't got into nursing, she would have done nursing and just sort of followed a path.

So it might have been a blessing in disguise because not many people give themselves any scope to think they're just like, okay, this is the path that set out for me and just walk that line and then that's all they're doing right without, without leaving anything open for change or expansion. That's right. And you sort of get to I think people usually get to the point where they're starting to have kids and they reassess whether they want to go back to whatever they were doing, um, or, you know, you get towards your midlife crisis and that's when you're like, oh my God, like I really hate my life. Yeah. If you think about it, like, you know, the parallel between, you know, where she could have gone and where she ended up, it's still about serving and helping people just in a different way, isn't it? Absolutely, That's right. And it was interesting because she did hint a little bit on a crossroad roads where she nearly left the industry when she had been in that horrendous workplace with the egos and she was going to leave. Mm hmm. I think pretty much every person we've interviewed has had a story of that as some sort haven't made and it's a theme that we've we've heard throughout.

Some have been more vocal about it than others and some have alluded to it. But it's fascinating cause everyone's like pushed through, no one has gone, you know what, I've been bullied and I've accepted it or it's affected my career pretty much everyone we've spoken to that has faced, that, including you and I ourselves as we've just gone, right, We're not going to accept it. And whatever we can do to change it and move, we will it is very empowering to know that there are so many people who have very similar overall stories. And so, you know, if our listeners have a similar situation that they're navigating, know that there it might be the Fairy Godmother person shows up and you move sideways into something that's perfect rather than just completely throwing your hands in the air. It's also interesting that when she was talking about going into working in the bank and I was thinking about the resources versus culture because she talked about the amazing education and support and things like that that they got when there are so many resources in the bank.

The culture was just wrong. I know and you almost I know when I've been in places like that, where you look at the culture and it's wrong. You go one of two ways, it is a bit of that fork in the road. You either go, okay, I'm just going to accept it for what it is because it's serving the role, is serving me at the moment for the sake of experience or you go, no, it's just too much. It really doesn't align with where I want to be and who I want to be and you and you walk away because I think trying to change that culture, One person can't do it as much as you think you want to, It doesn't happen, mm hmm It's okay, isn't it? To sit and use the role as a stepping stone and get the experience if that's the point in your life where you're just like I need to bed down some really good experience into my resume. And this is going to be the stepping stone for the next thing. Or even though the culture is pretty horrible. You know my kids are in the early stages of primary school. I just have to do this for five years or whatever. I know I did it when I moved from the U.

K. It was the most horrendous time in my life. I was barcoding documents for two years. I literally could have like stabbed myself in the heart at one point hold destroying it was in a room. I still remember it was in a room with no freaking windows as well. Like I mean knowing you the person you are now. I do not know how you did that for two years. I have to pay my bills literally. That's what it was. It was a new country struggling to get a job. You know? And it was just like the only place that I could get a job and I was just going to suck it up. We were constantly looking around though for other things while you were doing it as well. I was but I remember feeling that awful dread every single day going into work every single day and I'm like just another month, another month another month until something else came out. But I think we've all had jobs like that or we've all made sacrifices just to get, get that foot in the door. Right, mm hmm. Well, I wonder because you know, I look at my young team and I hope that they're not sucking it up just to get a few years under their belt.

But it can be a nice way to not in a bad way sometimes, you know, you do it because you know that you need that experience doesn't mean that it's a bad job or it's toxic. No, but I but I think everyone that's starting off does have to suck it up to some extent just to get to where they want to get too. Yeah. And look, even as an employer, I know from the majority of people that everything is a stepping stone and that this role will be a stepping stone to something else. And I hope that I can help people reach what they want and you know, grow and help with that. But it's when someone is just sucking about in a job because they don't have anything better. You just particularly as a small business owner just please move on. Yeah. But I also think that small business owners, our job is to help them flourish and get that next role because we don't I mean it's a small business, you know this, but the opportunities aren't going to be great in terms of progression all the time.

So you want them to gain that experience, you want to nurture them and I think it's such a satisfying feeling when they go, you know what I learned a lot, thank you so much. And now after my next thing, that's right and it's funny like Diana, that lady that's been working with me for about a year now, helping me build the the course she finished a couple of months earlier than planned, but she's just finished the work, which is great. But I was like, I was like really sad when she left, you know, and of course she was going to leave after the project was finished but I still felt the same, but we had such a good chat and she's like, you know what, I just literally learned so much doing this project with you and I can now take those skills and she's starting her own business up so she can actually use those skills in setting your own business up. It's one before when people are insightful enough to realize what they've gained too. I think that that is potentially the most rewarding thing about being a business owner is developing and seeing people grow into their own skills and strengths. Yeah, I think I enjoy that the most to be honest, we just had a staff development day last week that I've been putting off since july got postponed about four times.

I think it was just the best thing and I'm so glad that I did it with the team that I have at the moment because it really created a whole lot of language for us moving forward, Common language about how we work with each other and about where we want to be and all those sorts of things. It's just that really everyone was just buzzing on such a high was so good. Who facilitated it for you had a couple of facilitators. I had Sarah Jacobson who was one of our guests so I had her do a morning with us and in the afternoon I had a lady come back actually I must get Fran on our podcast. Yeah she's actually done the couple of hours with us on our staff development every day for the last four years. So she's sort of seeing the progression of the team and worked with us through our values and then our customer journey and she's just sort of extending the learning just a little bit further each year which is really good. Great and it's good it's a good time of year to do it isn't it? Because you know it gets people to sort of self reflect on on that before they all break up at the end of the year and you start off the year going, you know I now know what I want to do and where businesses going as opposed to running it early on in the year because then it's like, you know, you almost lose a few months attraction that way you can.

Absolutely, that's right. Mm hmm. So yeah, I suppose in some ways, I mean back around to what mel talks about when she's going through the money story. Like she gets people to shared a whole lot of unnecessary things and become quite clear in what they're wanting and who they actually are. And in some ways, you know, that's also what we did as a team, we shared a whole lot of unnecessary stuff and became really quite clear about who each of us are within the team as well as where the team is going. So yeah, it does. It makes you think about, I was listening to the podcast, I went on a big long walk and I was thinking about my money story and how it's like evolved and I did a, I actually did post on it today but like I've got a new money story issue that's come up as well just recently and it's around the course and what I want to charge for it and I've got this awful fear that no one's going to want it and I've put so much work into it and I'm not able to sell it and I even dream about it and it doesn't come from anywhere and you know, I go back to my own training to go, is that just the fear, which is false evidence appearing real, which is exactly what it is?

Or do you have evidence to back that up and you have to literally write it down and I was like, well there isn't any evidence because I've been running my coaching business, the contents are saying I have paying clients. So that fear is just, it's false in my own head. I was actually aware of that. But it does, it triggers you to go, you're constantly evolving. It's something you fix your money story once and then you fixed it for life. No, because every time you evolve in your business, a new thing, a new story will come up for you. Yeah, absolutely. And also, you know around price, I heard someone say this the other day, you're always going to get the price wrong and the price does not mean it has to always be that same price, like just keep changing it. In fact, here's an interesting one for you to try and get you out of that mindset. I was talking to a lady who was running a membership for people doing quilting of all things, right? She had had it set at what it was like $59 a month or something and she got a whole lot of ladies approaching retirement or retirees do it in there, she decided to raise it and I think she raised it to like $89 or something.

So you know, 20 or $30 raise no new people at that price whatsoever, Raised it up to $189. And all of a sudden even more members than what she had at the low price. Yeah, I've heard of that happened, I really heard of that happened before. It is but I won't mention names. But there was when I was looking at the pricing for my membership, the collective memberships are not my corporate eQ a program that the collective membership was talking to, Elijah, my business partner. And we've been coming and going on the numbers and it's it's a really low number for the value. And I'm like no we can't like we have to charge more because I'm like it's so much value. Anyway. We then did some research around what other memberships are there in our space and what do they charge? And we found one that's $800 a month us And it's got 40% less than what we've got in hours. Yeah and this person did a launch And they've got 100 people through the door. Oh my God. How life changing. Yeah. And I was like shit, like but it's that story again that comes up to go but everyone else can do it.

I can't, it's almost like it can work for other people. But for some years and I feel it's not gonna work for me and it's a ship story because of course it can work for me. It's like, you know, of course it can, but it's but it's our own thing. And I was talking to my best mate in the UK about it and he's like, can you just stop saying this? And I'm like, why? Because he's like, he goes, you manifest so quickly because you don't want to manifest the negative either. Just quickly shift that story when you feel it, because otherwise you will manifest it and then you'll be like, see I was right, it's true. We've got to dive deep into that topic on another podcast. We really do because this concept of everyone else can get it, but me, like, I'm different. Yes, I'm somehow inadequate or being punished or not good enough or imposter syndrome and that's what it is. I think it's even more than the more it is, more than that, you're right, it is more, it's around inadequacy self worth that we're not good enough.

Yeah. And this is really bizarre because I coached this ship and I still suffer from it at the best of times, you know? But yeah, last last few weeks doing this building this and creating, it's definitely come up for me and something that I'm literally every single day, working on without fail every single day. I'm like correcting those thoughts. We're at a very similar stage because our things are built and now we've got to go to market with them and I am just finding that in a way of subconsciously avoiding. I am so busy with everything else that I am just got no time whatsoever to actually put my thing out to the market because you know I'm inadequate. It'll be rejected. I don't want to be rejected. I've thought of that so I've still got time because my launches february so I've still got time because I'm still building the last bits of it and I got to go recording so my date is february. So I've actually said to myself that I'm not going to do any paid client work from february March april for three months because you know what that will do that will force me my program some cash flow perspective because otherwise I'll be like complacent.

But I've still got a little bit of income coming in from my one on one clients but I want to move away from that. The only way to move away from it is to back myself and go I'm not taking clients for those three months and I haven't like I got an opportunity last week and I said no and it will start in february afterwards and I'm like no and it was the hardest thing to do to say no. So gutsy, so gutsy. So that's going to force me right to to actually put it out there. Mm Well done. That's a very exciting time for you to Shut the doors to your business for three months, Jackie. No I'll just well I'm trying to hire someone to go into my shoes. They will fill my caseload. I will stop paying myself and then I need to sell my product. Yeah. Amazing. Well it's a very exciting time. It's good to start diving into some of this stuff at the same. You know we're paralleling each other so closely. Love to push each other. Yeah. So I mean anyone else having any of this similar stuff pop up?

I mean along the lines of money? Yeah it's such a great conversation to be having. Please comment on our web page where we post the episode I Q meets eq dot com dot au. Or we always put it onto linked in as well. So there will be a post there. Check it out. Or individual conversations where do they find you eq dot academy? Fantastic. And I am Jackie at legally wise women dot com dot au. Alrighty. Well until next time. Yeah. See ya. Thank you. Mhm

Ep84 Living life on your terms
Ep84 Living life on your terms
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