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"Why I'm running 5000 miles around the UK" - Paul Minter of Head-Up Charity

by Shaun Kober
May 16th 2022
01:07:49
Description

Head-Up Charity is a mental health organisation founded by four British Military Veterans with over 50 years of experience serving their country, including 11 operational tours. Their aim is to bui... More

what does it mean to live life to the fullest train to your potential and perform at your best, Leave nothing on the table. That's a non negotiable is that I strive to be better every day because if I'm not on top of my game, how is anybody else going to follow me down the road? Keep demanding more of yourself to live up to that potential and to stay hungry. Training is progress. You know, when I look at the word training, I think of steps, baby steps to get somewhere that you want to be and that is basically your life journey. That's a mindset and itself, man, it's like, it's not just about I know that for you, a lot of that's about the physical, but we're constantly in training, whether it's growing our skill sets, whether it's growing our physical bodies, whether it's growing our relationships, whatever and all of that is a training ground and that kind of goes back to the mindset that we just talked about. You underestimate yourself and you don't even start, but then once you start, you often surpass what you thought you could do perform at your best money. That's that's sort of what life is all about. You know, I don't have the knowledge and have the fitness, the healthy ambition and drive that no matter what comes along when that next phone call comes, I can just say yes, I don't have to worry, just go and do it, Yo what is up guys, Welcome back to the left transform podcast, I'm your host, Sean Cobra and joining me again for I think it's probably officially the second time, but unofficially about the fourth time paul, paul, minter of Head Up charity.

How are you mate? Yeah, good mate. Now for the listeners, um, Paul is the founder of head up charity who is running 5000 miles around the UK and he's currently two months, just over two months in. How many kilometers have you covered now mate? I don't work in kilometers. I'll do miles, kilometers will sound better, but I don't know About 1500 miles, 1500 Miles already. How's the body feeling? Body overall is good, but I think I've gotten that niggles and pains hips. I wear a 10 kg bag with a four ft flag flying as well. So with the wind, it can cause a lot of drag my hips, taking a bit of a batter in my knees are, but like I think I said to you before, um, don't need to be expected. I can't, I can't be doing this crazy sort of mileage every day and not expect to have it, but no real, no real pains, nothing. Um, cause it any real problems. Yeah, and I mean the causes so prominent in your mind and I'm sure that that is enough to get you over the line every single day.

Um, can you explain to the listeners why Exacting you're running 5000 miles around the UK. Absolutely. So myself and some others, three other guys diamond as you, you know very Well. And then two others have set up a charity called Head Up Charity. We've all come war factories have all come, spent many years in the armed forces between us. We've Done something like 15 doors. Um, and we've all lost a lot of friends to suicide myself. I was in a really bad place at one point and I felt that the help and the services that were available to me missing lots of different things and, and speaking to lots of different people, they feel the same way. Um, so we come together and we basically had enough of going to our friend's funerals and seeing our friends in crap places. So we've, we've, we've decided to come Up with an idea to develop a seven day positive mindset treat completely non militarized, but for all services of the armed forces, including veterans and reservists, which is over five million people in the UK.

Um, and we've got a, we've got big business plan to get multi million pound retreats set up and as a new charity, um, it's very difficult to get the word out there to let people know who you are to get back in networking connections. So I came up with the ingenious and somewhat crazy idea of running all around the UK. Um, all the coastlines and basically just flying the flag, talking to people making connections, making networking, letting people know who we are getting a charity named in People Mouse. And also do a decent amount of fund raising as well. Mm hmm. That's incredible, man. And if anyone's interested to hear the backstory and you know, the demons that paul dealt with himself, um you know, after multiple combat deployments in Afghanistan, Um, you know, and all of the ramifications that occurred from those deployments. Um you know, we went pretty dark. We went pretty deep. Um we shared a lot of your story, but also your lessons and the tools that you used to get yourself out of a funk, Get yourself out of a dark place, deal with your demons.

And I'm assuming that that's like an ongoing process. Right? That's something that's still happening today. Yeah, I mean, I can't speak for everyone. But certainly for myself, you know, these memories and feelings, emotions, they don't go away just because you feel better for a few weeks or a few months. It's something that you should work on every single day and you can learn to use these emotions and feelings uh your strengths and also to help other people in the process. So, I'm constantly holistically working on myself every day. This run is all a huge therapy session for me as well. Mm That's an excellent point man. Um and it's something that I want to touch on. That was you know, this question or that question was kind of leading towards um you know, you it is a constant working process um and you need to put the work in and you listen to the episode that Simon and I recorded a couple of weeks ago and I'll have that link in the show notes for the audience as well, but you know, something that he spoke about was he's like, man paul is just in war mode, and I explained, it was like, you know, it's like when you're on deployment, you just have your ship squared away and you're ready to go at a moment's notice and you've got a vision, you've got to drive, you've got um something that's pushing you every day, you've got something to work towards, you know who your identity is, um and you know what that identity needs to do on a daily basis, and that's exactly what you're doing, man, this is where a lot of guys, veterans in particular, but you know, the world, the wider world in the last couple of years going through the pandemic has experienced themselves, they have lost their tribe, their identity, their purpose, their motivation, their direction, they don't really know who they are.

And this is something that, again, is a constant work in process and you're going through that now and um talk to me about the similarities of what you're doing right now and being on deployment and how um that's working for you in managing your mind and and you know, we'll kind of go into some of the things that you have been thinking about and how you have been processing things a little bit differently because as you mentioned, it's not just about um, you know, feeling doing some things that make you feel good for a couple of weeks. Like you need to reframe those stories. Those narratives take some lessons from the past, overlay them onto your present, which is then going to shape your future. Yeah, absolutely. And I love the fact that you and Simon touched on is like a mission. You know, this is like a tour for me that, I mean, the fact that my run is lasting seven months, that's how long, that's how long a tour used to last. So, you know, the way I look at it, I'm away, I'm um I'm on a mission.

I've got missions, I've got mission statement, I've got goals and targets and certain things that we've got to do every day. But the things that I'm doing are all very similar every single day just with different people making new connections. Um but yeah, it's like, it's like, it's a mission and every day is, is a fun and exciting way to promote what we're, what we're talking about. I when I started this charity, I completely cut off all strings financially, you know, I haven't taken away since I left the army because I live off my savings and a bit of passive income. So financially, you know, very much in a much less a better position than I was before. So now what I would have thought that, but for me it drives the purpose even more. It makes the mission even more important. Yeah. And it's, it's just, it's a really fun, enjoyable head space to be in. Mm hmm. Let's talk about some of the headspace is that you've gone through, um, and been in because I'm sure there's been some fluctuations as with everyday life, man.

You know, people try and chase happiness and if you try and chase happiness, it's a, it's an emotion, right? Like it's fleeting. It comes and goes and there's so many things that influence emotions and some of those things we can influence ourselves by the, you know, the way that we're living our life and how we're eating and sleeping and training and all that meditation and all that type of stuff. But you know, we don't have total control over that. Yes, we can influence it, but we don't have total control. There's other external factors that contribute to how we're feeling on a daily basis. How are hormones operator neurotransmitters? So on so forth. Now, talk to me about some of the biggest hires that you felt whilst you've been running, Have you felt um, like anything like the runner's high that people talk about getting into a flow state, just having complete clarity on what you're doing while you're doing it and the direction that you're moving in. So every, so every day. Just so to give you a bit of clarity as to how much days work and then you have a better understanding as to the sort of crazy high as I'm getting all the time is I don't ever go home, I've got a backpack on, This is me for several months, going from town to town to town and every evening I stayed with someone new, someone I've never met before.

I've stayed with Lords Mps, teachers, fishermen, veterans, all sorts of people from all walks of life and every single person has a story. Everyone wants to talk to me, everyone wants to hear my story and that in itself is a height, having strangers take me into the house, take me into, you know, look after me for an evening and the morning and you know, wanting to hear my story that, you know, and just being in that, engaging the situation with someone I've never met before and opening up them opening up to me, it is a huge fire in itself and being social, being open minded to talk to different people who have different views to yourself or similar views is a really big high, but seeing the gratitude of being grateful, so grateful of how how nice people are the humanity of just strangers coming out, people, people come to cheer me on and I've been running down the road, I've Had people drive 50 miles inland just to say well done paul, we appreciate what you're doing and that's it.

There you go again, and they've Got to drive 50 miles back home again. That is such a big higher because this, this charity and the people that I want to help, but we want to help. Um it's Huge. I've lost three More friends of suicide to start and run two months ago, you know, and I'm talking to, so for me this is really personal, this is really a big thing and to have people that just want to come along and say, you know, we feel you we feel we understand what you're going through, we appreciate that you're trying to do something to help people. Um that that's a big high, but also everyday, you know, I've had, I've had hundreds and hundreds of people joined me on runs. I've had everything from a 12 year old girl who ran 14 miles. She Only ever done like three or 4 Miles before. She ran 14 miles with her dad. I've had a 74 year old man who dusted off, he's running trainers after 14 years just to do two miles with me. And so many people coming out, I've had people on bikes because they can't walk properly.

Um I've had people who who run for great Britain professional runners come and join me to talk about stuff, veterans, all sorts. So that is the biggest high every single day. I wake up thinking who am I going to meet, what stories are going to share and I'm never disappointed. So that the heart is just a constant height for the whole day and just seeing the humanity, the humanity, the niceness of people is the biggest higher that you can get. That's incredible, man. Like I was getting emotional just listening to that, I've got a few tears in my eyes now man, I'm really, it's really inspirational bro, I've got to say um something that came up for me then is, you know, a lot of veterans when they are going through a tough time, they do isolate themselves and they do put themselves in a position where they're not seeing people and they don't like going out into the public and meeting new people and being around new people and crowds and things like that. Did you ever go through anything like that? And if so, has this the last couple of months going through this process, meeting new people, has that helped ease um you know, any apprehension about being around new people being a new environment etcetera.

Yeah, I mean we touched on it before, so I'm not gonna go into it too deeply, but I suffered really bad with paranoia really badly to the point that um, you know, all sorts of bad things were happening in my life and I'm getting paranoid and it turns to anxiety and depression and you just don't want to go outside no more, you don't want to get into situations or that you have your mind in themselves situations and people have all different reasons why they get into that sort of state. For me, it was a very slow burn and and I ended up being very recluse, I didn't talk to people much if I was going to the gym headphones and I'd be by myself, I wouldn't say hello to anyone walking down the street, head down because I don't want thoughts coming into my mind and then I had to spend months and months and months in my room on my own not talking to anyone. So that had a real long lasting effect on my head and um so when I, when I started decided to change my life around and get get better, the first thing I did was put self worth back into me. So I've done this, I've done a whole bunch of crazy challenges, But that was about 12, 12 per 14 months worth of me just getting getting myself back out there, but I still wasn't talking to people, the women when I have completed these challenges and I've done really well, I then had to work on my social skills because I still wasn't talking to people, even if I was going out the pubs or bars or event, you know, I'd always be just, just hang around the same people that I knew, I didn't want to talk to anyone.

Um, so now this has this run has really put me in the mix. I can't be any more out there and sociable. And you know what in your, in our head, sometimes we play stories of this person isn't quite likely they're going to think this or they're going to be like that or they're not gonna understand me and we let it get to us. But actually when you just open up with someone in any any form or just say hello or just ask them how to do it, you'll be so surprised that how the sort of feedback do you get? And, you know, we make, as I say, we make so many stories up in our heads and they're just stories that's who they are. Um, he just got to talk to people to find out, find out about them. And you'd be very surprised at how nonjudgmental people actually. Mm hmm, interesting what you just said then. Um, and it's something that I've, my brain is just ticking at the moment. Like when you decided to run 5000 miles around the UK to raise awareness, raise funds. Um, draw attention to head up charity, what you guys were doing in the mental health space in the UK.

You know, wanting to build this retreat to give veterans and give people that were kind of struggling, not necessarily struggling. Some people may be struggling. Some people, you know, a little bit more proactive. Give them these tools will be able to educate them at this resort. So then they can take back to their life, implement, teach their network, teach their friends, teach their mates, etcetera. When you were thinking about running around the UK, did you um like when you were planning it out in your head, did you consider that, you know, did you deliberately put yourself in that position where like I'm going to stay with random people, I'm gonna get by on the kindness of strangers and have people open their doors for me, feed me so on so forth. Like is that something that you like a decision you made consciously to put yourself in that situation to help you, as you said, be part of your therapy? Yeah, absolutely. Was that something that just unfolded organically? No, this is this is a deliberate plan by me. You know, one I wanted to run around and spread the word. I was I was I wouldn't say terrified because bit of a powerful word, but I was very anxious about meeting people, but you know, how am I going to get because I know that I can go into my shell, I go into my shell quite heavily and I'm like, I don't want to be going into my shell when I'm meeting someone new and I've not been that sort of person to go and approach people and talk to them.

I've never been like that and but I knew that I needed, I knew that I wanted to change, I knew that I wanted to be a more sociable person and be more interactive. So I know that it's better for me mentally um especially with the job or the role that I'm going into now helping people. I need to be that that sort of person that talks to people and not just one type of person, like the, like the typical hardcore soldiers, like the people I know already, but just people from all walks of life from all cultures, from um all job, um different jobs, places old and young, all sorts and that's, and sometimes I know that I'm going to people contact all the time said poor want to run the future, but I'm gonna run with you and I always get that instant goodness, you know how we're gonna get on as soon as we meet. You know, you can feel each other's energy. You look at each other, your smile, you're saying, hey, thanks for coming and joining me today and they're instantly smart and then going out and they're feeling the same way they're a bit anxious. Two minutes into the conversation or by the end of the run were hugging each other and we're like, let's stay in touch, you know, we feel with that connection, that bond is so strong and, and but before that I'm all, I'm all like fluttery and going, oh my goodness, what's again what's going to happen here.

But the more you do it, the more you get used to it and it's just it's yeah, so that right there everything you just said then is like you're conditioning yourself, right? You made a conscious decision that you know, you have had some maybe social anxiety, haven't been comfortable in group environments etcetera, but you kind of force yourself, you made that conscious decision that this is going to be part of the process, you know of running around the UK raising awareness is you know, that's a part of your therapy as well, you need to put yourself in a position where you are going to be a little bit uncomfortable and as you said, the more you do it, the more comfortable you become, you become conditioned to that and I think that's really powerful point for the audience to take away is you know, if you do feel a little bit anxious about something, you don't feel comfortable about something like you know, we need to challenge yourself, that's what that's what adaptation is. We are adaptation machines, especially like combat veterans, man, like we are fucking adaptation machines, like we get taught how to be the jack of all trades and like you just get shipped done with the least amount of resources, right?

And as humans, we are very good at adapting to things, but we can also adapt in a negative manner if we remove ourselves from group environments, we don't start seeing people, we limit our social um exposure and things like that. Then we start adapting in that manner and we become less and less comfortable in those environments. But it goes the other way as well. Like if you start exposing yourself to that stuff a little bit more, put yourself in those positions and it's not like you go, hey I'm going to go into a Fucking room with 10,000 people, you go all right, I'm going to go out like for dinner with a couple of people that I don't know, Maybe there's one friend there, I'm going to put myself in environment where I'm meeting a couple of new people, start small and once you get comfortable there then you build, then you build, then you build and that's exactly what adaptation is, man, give yourself just enough stress, put yourself in just enough of an uncomfortable position that you're a little bit uncomfortable. But afterwards you're like, you know what, That wasn't that bad, I can deal with that better next time. And then you know, you build, you build, you grow, you adapt and then all of a sudden you're comfortable talking in front of a heap of people and you know this is this was a massive part of the process for me with the podcast man like where I recorded the 6th May, 20 four May has been two years of podcasting.

And for me when I first started man, I go back and I listened to those first podcast episodes and you know, I was rubbish, absolutely rubbish. Now I'm recording podcasts without doing any editing. I was doing so much editing back in the day man, but now my confidence in being in front of a camera and speaking, you know, his has improved dramatically just because I put myself in that position. And initially when I first started the podcast I was like uh you know what if I say something wrong, what if I swear too much? What if people don't like it? What if there were blah blah blah blah? And I was like whatever, like just put yourself in that position, You've got to put yourself in a little bit of an uncomfortable position if you want to grow if you want to learn if you want to adapt to it. And it's awesome to hear what you're saying man and go through that process yourself. Now you've been talking about connections and again this is very important, especially as a, you know, a lot of veterans when they do transition out of the military, um they do lose their tribe and that is a very important part of um making good social connections and when we lose those social connections, you know, again it makes it easier to then start becoming a little bit of a recluse and isolating self, not talking to people So and so forth.

So can you talk to me about some of the most memorable connections that you've made and conversations that you've had with people. You know basically strangers that you're meeting on this journey and you might meet them for one day and then you know you're off the next day. Like talk to me about some of the most memorable conversations that you've had and how that's affected you. I really appreciate that question because it just makes me so happy when I when I think there's so many different um things that have happened so far so many different connections, so many different people and there's some huge things that have happened. Um Well if I go back to fairly old and fairly early on when I run only a few weeks in um One guy put me up in the ex Navy And you've been up navy for 15 years and you know it wasn't in the best shape. He wasn't completely unfit but he just he moved to a certain new area. I didn't know anyone kind of had the issue Is in his head there's there's a lot of people do but he hadn't spoken to anyone about it 15 years anyway.

He met me I had another guy running with me um staying with me for a week very similar to myself and when we first met him he came and joined us. We stayed at his house with his his wife and his his newborn baby. And he instantly got a connection from us and we were just so open and talking about staff and very positive in our ways. Talking about different ways that we, we what we do to strengthen our mindset every day. And you could just see the spark in his eyes. He was just like, oh my goodness, this is like this is something I've had in my head, but just it's just been going around my head and I didn't realize other people even thought it. Um and then we're told about some of the problem and he's like, yeah, I've had those problems too. And you can just see the elation coming out of him. So the next day he decided to join and he was like, you know what, I don't want you guys to disappoint disappear from my life just yet. So he told her it's not coming in, that they think he pulled the sticky or something and then he came running with us. But just so happened on that day, another guy, next paratrooper came and joined us And he'd been out for 10 years and exactly the same position had been very reclusive the last few years.

He hadn't spoken to anyone like that. His feelings and emotions, it's become a very spiritual person. But because of the people around him, you know, they saw that all of that as wishy washy and again he couldn't open up and we were between the four of us, We were just talking about um sort of spiritual sort of feelings, how we all felt it. And the two guys that joined us that that the paratrooper and a navy guy, they were just, you could see them in their faces, they were just so related that someone else had had their feelings and it wasn't just them and able to talk to each other or talk to different people about it. And then the best thing that came out of that Is those two people who had lived maybe a mile away from Each other for 10 years, I didn't know about each other struggling with the same things. They're now best friends and they go running almost every single day of each other. They're able to talk to each other, they're expanding their network and talking to other people. And it's just really, it's and that's a really nice story, you know, that was so early on in the run and to know that two people who were struggling with their thoughts and emotions and now they're able to talk to people.

Um and they both stay in contact now and they both say thank you so much for correcting us even though I didn't mean to, but it's just that's just what happens. Um that was a fantastic story. That is incredible, man, I'm emotional again bro. Um what that brings up for me is like, you know, how important it is to have the right people around you that are on the same wavelength because, you know, as you said man, like a lot of people experience the same thing, but they think they're alone, but when you have people around you that are on the same wavelength and you know, you talked about the spiritual side of things and you know, it's we're kind of in this age where it's like the spiritual side of things, it's kind of a little bit like wishy washy some people into it, some people are not into it. Um but I think I believe it's going through like a transitional period where it's going to be a lot more widely accepted in the next decade or two. Um but you know, the, the importance for me of having people on the same wavelength is being able to communicate because again, you're not going through those feelings alone, other people go through those feelings when you have people on the same wavelength.

If they've been on the same journey, maybe they've been on that journey for a little bit longer than you and maybe they're able to, like, you share what's going on with you what you're feeling, how you're feeling, you know, you maybe you can explain why you're feeling that way, but someone else has been on that journey a little bit longer and they've experienced that and the words that they use and the stories that they tell themselves and um you know, the narrative, they create, it helps you understand where you're at and helps you find your place. And that's the importance of having a good network of people that are on the same wavelength as you. Is that it, you know, you get to have this communication and I think we've spoken about this before, like when you, when you talk about things like that's how you help organize your thoughts when you write things down. When you speak, you get get an opportunity to organize your thoughts. Like you have So many 60, 70 1000 thoughts go through your brain every single day. And if you don't have a way to organ is that then it just becomes a jumble, it becomes a mess. Mm hmm. Yeah, you've got to talking to people is a way of journaling, isn't it?

It's a way of getting everything out there. Even if you think hot, even if you think later on, not half of what I said with rubbish, it doesn't matter like journaling half of that. Like I've listened to you talking before you call it like brain dumping. Just get it all out on the, on the paper, get it out there, but you can do that through talking as well. And when you're running or walking or doing some sort of physical activity when all your all your systems are stimulated. There's no better way than a bad time to talk to someone. Yeah, absolutely man, mate, that's a that's a really cool story, um I want to go to the other side now um about, you know, you felt these amazing highs, but this is life, man, you know the higher the highs, the higher the peaks, the lower the troughs, right? Like we we it's it's very difficult to live in this happy medium. So I'm sure there's been times where you have gone to a dark place mentally and you know, maybe something's hurting first thing in the morning, you just got a little Niggle and then that that one thing that's just, you know, I'm sure there's been times where it's been like a lonely trail where you don't see anyone for a long period of time, hours at a time, miles at a time, right where you know those little niggles just kind of get amplified.

Maybe the weather is a little bit shitty, Maybe you know whatever, you didn't get a good night's sleep or your left a little bit late or whatever those external circumstances are like, you know those things, again, they're going to influence your mindset your attitude, how you're feeling your thoughts, your emotions. So has there been times where you have kind of gone down the other way and you are experiencing some of those troughs mentally and physically Yeah, slightly, I mean it's as soon as I do because because the position I'm in and every, like I say every single morning I'm with someone or everything throughout the day? Normally I'm with someone? Not always, but I've normally got people running with me, so it's quite difficult to get those, those lows because I'm always with someone, and when you're in someone's company, you kind of, you put that extra armor on and you don't allow yourself to get in that position, especially if it's a stranger, you don't know, but what one thing that has happened, I don't know if I might affect my reputation a bit, but I'll be honest if, but you know, when you sound like a big run or you don't, you know, if you've done a marathon or something, you kind of finish and then you go, do you want a drink?

You know that that because because you will achieve something and you're like, I just want, you want to wind down there, have a drink and wind out. So I guess because I'm running six out of seven days a week, and I'm averaging 31 miles a day, and I'm constantly talking about mental health, talking about problems, talking about suicides and deep conversation, you know, it gets you a bit, Sometimes if I get somewhere to, I just want to have a drink, uh and then sometimes 234 drinks later, I'm like, oh my goodness, you know, it affects me a bit, and the next day, and then wake up and I feel crappy about myself, and I'm like, why did you do that? Why did you go and have them drinks again? And the next day it happens again. I've got a few more drinks. So I think I've been drinking more on this run that I was before and it's it's pretty crazy and you think about it, but sometimes you gotta let yourself have the moments. Um But yeah, that, that, that kind of like, I guess, I guess, I guess frustrated with myself, But I think, I think the purpose behind this run is so strong for me and that's how I've lost three more friends since doing this run.

But whenever I have these moments, I think my bodies are, and I'm on my own, I've been running in bloody freezing cold temperatures, it's raining all day, my feet are soaking wet bag hurts. What am I actually doing? You do get those moments. But then very quickly I'm so mentally prepared and like you said, I'm on this mission and it's, it's such a strong mission that mentally I'm changing uh how I'm thinking or messages that the lows are not being too low when I get the lows normally is if I'm by myself in a department or something And there's no one around me and I end up like I end up having a few drinks and they put some crap of food and what I would normally have done around other people, but then, you know, I can quickly snap out of it and go, do you know what, that's, that's in the past, it's starting, let's move on, let's let's move forward and we can improve. Yeah, I love that man. Um and to tie in what you're saying, they're like, I totally understand running and then feeling like sharing these conversations, going through these different emotions, meeting new people, etcetera, and then wanting to have a drink at the end of the day, like just feeling like you need to have a drink, you know, there's a couple of things that I want to touch on as well because there's going to be some physiological um there's gonna be some science, not, I don't wanna say science, but um there's going to be some factors that contribute to that.

Like you're covering a lot of miles every day, right? Like you're burning through a lot of energy. So, you know, your body is going to be like craving some energy, some quick energy that's going to be utilized, right? Um And also, you know, drinking alcohol is a decent way to wind down sometimes. Can it affect sleep? Yes. Can it leave you a little bit dehydrated? Yes. Can it leave you a little bit inflamed? Yes, but it's like anything, man, you know, if you use it for the right reasons, then it can be beneficial for you. If you Have one or two beers, three beers helps take the edge off, helps you unwind after being, you know, in a, in a heightened state all day, then you know, that's going to lead you to sleep better. It's going to allow you to have potentially drop your inhibitions and have better conversations, deeper conversations, better connections with the people that you're meeting, right? So you know, don't beat yourself up about that man, like enjoy it for what it is because you know in the, in the world that we live in, everything is celebrated around food and alcohol, right?

Like whenever we get together for christmas is barbecues, birthdays, weddings, even funerals, right? There's always food and drink that we used to celebrate, right? So you know, if you use that tool correctly, it can provide many benefits. If you use that tool incorrectly, it can cause you to go off track a little bit. So um yeah, I totally understand where you're coming from man, but don't beat yourself up about it bro, you're using it for a purpose, right? As long as you make a conscious decision, hey, I'm justifying this decision because I'm meeting these new people, they want to have a drink with me, I'm happy to have a couple of drinks with me, but I know my limit if I have five drinks, probably going to go a little bit too far, I'm gonna wake up tomorrow, how to ship sleep, perform poorly, um you know, be carrying information, make poor decisions with food, so on so forth, But I know that I can get away with three or 4 drinks and it's not having too much of a detrimental impact if anything, it's actually adding to my conversations and my connections.

Yeah, no, I like that. I like that and that certainly is what I've been telling myself. So, you know, and I know that you know, it's when I don't have a drink, like my and I'm doing this fitness my I'm sure, you know, my level of fitness and mind mind state is so strong, it's so powerful. Like I'm on another level and then it's like it's so strong that I think that's probably why I didn't sometimes have a drink to try and bring myself back down again because I'm like I'm floating up from way up, way up higher. Um but then when I have a drink I come down a bit then I think that sometimes when I get into it, well he was so high up there, maybe there's a reason for it, you know, and it's not like it's it hasn't affected. I'm still running 30 plus miles every day. I'm still meeting people still making connections, but like you say it's it's not necessarily a bad thing. I think I was trying to find any sort of low low points because there was this, this journey has been such a higher higher time, but I think the low point is really going to come at the end, be fair, I'm not gonna lie.

I think this this flying hires for so long for seven months and I'm sure at the end it's gonna be, you know, pretty strong for another few more weeks, especially when it comes to media and everything. Um and then there's going to be here. So I'm trying to psychologically prepare myself for that somehow, brilliant man. That's that was actually going to lead into my next question, you know, because it's the same as well as you mentioned earlier, coming back from deployment, like your your overseas, you're on fucking high alert all the time and then all of a sudden like your back in your hometown and like nobody around you knows what you've gone through what you've seen and you know, it goes both ways of course, but um you know, you it's it's kind of like alright, that's done and it's like you've got nothing to work towards and it happens all the time with athletes man. You know, people that um compete at the highest level, they win a gold medal at the olympics and then they retire and they're like, what? Now? That's when the wheels start falling off, right?

What are some of the tools that you're using or what are some of the thoughts that come into your mind to kind of help you deal with that. I mean, the first thing is being aware, I love the fact that you said that's probably going to be the biggest low point and when you're aware of something, you can prepare for it. If you're unaware of it, you can't prepare, right? And the point is like, you fucking know what's going to happen, You've just got to ride it out, man, you've got to use your tools and figure out what's gonna work best for you. We just recently had ANZAC Day in Australia. Um, so that's where we, you know, it's a day of reminiscing for when the ANZAC Australia new Zealand army corps land in Gallipoli in World War, World War One and you know, that was uh, you know, the first conflict that Australia was involved with as a young nation. Um and you know, the ANZAC spirit is something that's been built upon and Australians are proud of. Um and every ANZAC day is a tradition with my military mates where we get together in a city, a different city every year.

Um, and you know, we put aside our own lives and we spend a couple of days together and reminisce, have a couple of beers, you know, throw some banter, just catch up on all the good times, the bad times. Um and you know, get the families involved and we want to see them, we want to see the families, um the wives and girlfriends, the kids, etcetera. You know, we want them to see how important it is to see our mates so that we can continue this tradition and you know there's been times in the past man where I'll go back to Australia, I haven't been back to Australia for three years for it, but I'll go back to Australia and have the fucking time of my life. But then I get back to Thailand and I just feel a little bit empty and I feel a little bit lost and I feel a little bit depressed because I've just caught up with some of the most important people and someone most loved family members and friends, you know that I haven't seen for years, I've just caught up with so many of them in such a short period of time, it's just just like overwhelming emotion and then I get back to Thailand and don't get me wrong I love my life here, but I don't have the same connections that I do.

You know when I go back for ANZAC Day and I remember a couple of years ago I was talking to one of my mates, maybe you know him blind tristan from Blind Tiger yoga, he's not running blind Tiger anymore. He's been a guest on the podcast. Really, really good dude. Um one of my best mates man and I remember a couple of years ago I was I was like hey man we're going to Brisbane for ANZAC Day, you're gonna come up this year and he goes, you know what? He goes I don't want to come man like because I have such a good time that when I get home, I'm depressed for at least a month or two afterwards, you know, and I don't want to I don't want to put myself in that position and I was like, man, you're 100% right. But in saying that, like, I'm like, I felt the same as well. However, I'm willing to put myself in that position. I'm willing to make that sacrifice, just so I get to experience that, Hi, I'm willing to experience that low, so I get to experience that high. Yeah. What, what a conflict of emotions though, isn't it? And you know, I think going back to us being on tours of soldiers or whatever service you're in, You're you're away for about 6, 7 months maybe on average, maybe a bit longer and you don't drink.

Your minds is so clear. You're you're in a great position and then you're just thinking that's all I'm going when I get back, I'm gonna invest in this property, I'm gonna buy this car, I'm gonna do this course. I'm going to do their masters and PhD and all sorts of stuff and then you go back and you're back into reality with people that, you know, you knew before you left and you just um you're having a few drinks and reality hits you again and you're back to the person you were before you went on tour and you get that, that that kind of what happened to this superhero I created in my head. So it definitely happens And I think you're right. I think you need to put yourself in that position. If something makes you happy then go and do it. And like you said, awareness is the most important key. But when you're starting to feel that, okay, when I'm going to go to an ANZAC day, I'm gonna have the time in my life and then we'll come back and I'm going to sell crack. Okay, so what methods, let's, let's Write down what I can do on day one when I come back. What am I gonna do? Let's just put my feet up. Let's absorb everything.

Let's reflect on the good times. Let's maybe have a phone call with a couple of guys that were not having colored off instantly. That's, that's reminisced about what happened over the weekend and then, okay, then they too have recovered a bit. Let's go to the gym, let's do whatever and you know, just get, get, get a process going so that you're not just sitting indoors thinking, you know, being a, because I'm sure going meeting, I'm, when I meet all my army mates, I adore adore them so much and I have this elation when I meet them, I just can't stop smiling. I become this little kids around them and then I go away and you know, but, but what's happened is as good as good as a feeling as it is. These are still guys that I went through some of the most darkest times with, so you've still got you've got those um emotions subconsciously, probably maybe consciously going on in your head. I met, I met George, what an amazing guy. We certainly done three tours together.

However, I was also, it was also meaning him that picked up our mate's body or or whatever it may be. And even though you're not talking about it on a day or you might be talking about, it's then gonna start flooding back to you when when all the endorphins start to calm down. Mhm. Yeah. And again that's that connection that you've made with that person, whenever you're with that person, you've got these associated emotions that come up as well? Yeah, man, so it's a difficult one, but you know, it is as you mentioned, like just being aware of something, knowing that you are going to go through that process that um you know that not not necessarily a trough, but you know some down times um and you know starting starting to put some tools into place and thinking about some methods that you can use to to help you deal with that now when do you finish your run? So but that is it today? Is there like a fool for maybe 15 basics make something like that, so I don't finish So um I don't finish till four October it's a long way away.

Um you know, I'm I'm doing a new route that no one's ever done before. I'm running England Scotland Wales, northern Ireland at the isle of Wight and The Island Man. No 1's ever put all of these in together. Some people have done bits of them, but I'm actually doing it in a shorter time than anyone who don't even the lesser countries, um because I would want to get this over and done with, that's why I have to run 30 plus miles a day. The fourth of october, it seems like a long way away and, you know, it is a long way away, but I'm already over two months through, which it doesn't feel like, which is fantastic. Yeah, absolutely. What are your plans when you do finish the run? Like you're going to take a little bit of time off, You're gonna have some down time, you're going to launch straight into, like, media commitments and um talk to me about that process. Like, what what are some of the things you've already thought about that you're looking to put into place, The pr has got to be number one, you know, we're gonna be, we're gonna be hitting pr hard, we've got opportunities. Um two really promote this run and the charity, I mean I'm not saying that I'm in the same bracket, but you look at ross Edgeley when he swam around the UK islands.

he did, he had very minimal media connections it was until we finished. It was spiraled out of control and you know, you see where he is now. So if I can kind of like hit into that sort of pr and you know, start, I've already got quite a few big tv shows interested once I finished, so I can I can I can foresee that happening, hopefully fingers for us and that's going to bring in a lot more money, a lot more connections and backing full of charity. But the big thing for me is the charity uh, is because we formed the charity, so we are a full nonprofit charity, but we're non active, which you're not supposed to be, you know, if you I mean, you've got a charity, you're supposed to be helping people with it, but we need to fundraise to develop this retreat. So in a bit of a catch to here. So, you know, the charity regulations are going to be all over us going, why are you still not done anything? I don't think so, as soon as I finished, I need to be looking at sites, looking at development construction and I'm already talking to all these sorts of people.

Uh so it's gonna be a very, very busy time, but fun and enjoyable. And that's the whole point. Yeah, it's funny what you just said, why have you not done anything, man? I'm just running five 1000 miles. Yeah. Looking at that, that they want to see how many numbers of people you've helped. I'm like, well, I can't give you numbers of, you know, I have helped people help people on the run, but that they won't see that as the charity itself, but it's fine, it's fine because we'll slug it through because they don't see numbers, man. They don't see numbers going somewhere. They don't see money being donated. Like, that's a that's a brilliant point, man. Like, and that was that was a question that I was going to ask you as well, because obviously a lot of people have helped you going through this run, and, you know, have played a part in your therapy in quotation marks, right? But I guarantee that you've helped a lot of people as well. I mean, you mentioned that story about those two guys that you connected that are now fucking best buddies that are bouncing off each other, man. Like, that's incredible, mate. Like, have you, have you um you know, had people reach out to you and say, you know, like, you really sparked something in me that helped me change, or um you know, has anyone shared any stories with you?

And um just talk to me about, like, how some of the feedback that's come back from people that you may have helped on this journey, uh It's lots of people come back to me um when I say lots, I couldn't put a number on it, but it's probably in the hundreds what people so far have said to me for listening to your story running with you, talking with you. Seeing what you're doing for people is thank you so much. You've inspired me, you've helped me, you've changed me but me and Simon, um one of the other co founder, we're constantly and talk to people, so I'll give you one example is up in Scotland state of an ex an officer from an infantry battalion who had a really bad time in Afghanistan. He was in charge of a group of guys lost a lot. He blames himself a lot and he has done for a long time. Um He's been all over the place for quite quite a while, even with his family and he really wanted to connect with me.

He came running with me, came slightly and put me up at his, we had some really deep conversations and he's been, he's been a big actor that he's been screaming and shouting, telling everyone um you know, head up charity is such a great thing, paul has helped change my life. Simon has been on the phone with him, he's putting him in touch with certain other people. Um So, and I'm actually, I've got a talk, he worked for a very big energy company and they he told them what I was doing and how I've helped him. Um we're actually trying to keep being on medication. You've been on medication for the last 10 years. He really wants to come off it and he hasn't been able to. So we're actually putting him through a process now where he where he can get yourself in such a good mind mind that that he should hopefully be in a good place to come off his medication. So we're working with that and he's so grateful that he spoke to his company Dave now sponsored the run. Um and then, look, I've got, I've got a call with them after this. Well, I'm talking to hundreds of their veterans community and they're looking to make some large donations for the charity, but also be connected with head up in the future where they can send their veterans and also keep help financially keep us running.

So as it's, you know, it's that's been fantastic. And then there's there's been there's been lots of notifications and that's what keeps me on the high. And so many people just saying um messaging me saying, paul that run was fantastic. Your conversation, your energy, your enthusiasm, your, your willingness to put yourself out there to help people is it's it's it's feeding my ego, but I'm trying not to let it because yes, it's a nice thing and I've got I've got to do that, but I don't like to be that person in the spotlight. You know, I don't want everyone going, oh look at this guy, Look how amazing it makes me feel really cringe and awkward. So, but lots of people coming forward and saying thank you and you really helped me. And I've had, I've had lots of people, civilian people who have, but they've got no connection to the military, but they may have lost someone to suicide or they may have have family members are really struggling and they're saying, look, although we're not military, we appreciate that.

People like you and other people out there are putting themselves out there to help people in the world, wider world, everyone needs someone at some time. So yeah, it's been really nice. Yeah, that's really cool man. Um I was laughing when you're when you're saying you don't like being in the spotlight because I'm the same man. Like I, you know, went from being a sniper where you go out, you want to be fucking good at your job, but you also want to be a ghost. You don't want anyone to know who you are, You don't want any recognition. You just want to go out and just fucking, you know, protect the boys, do what you need to do and then sink back into the shadows, right? But over the last probably two years, what's that now? If you still feel proud of it though, don't you? You feel proud. But then when people publicly um say well done, it's a bit like, you know, stop, stop me using my name man dude. It's, it's, it's going to be an interesting, I mean this is probably a good conversation for us to have as well because you know over the last couple of years um my kind of profile on social media has built um quite rapidly I'd say probably over the last nine months or so last year and you know, obviously with the journey that I've been on with going to Russia with Petey and and like you know when even like when Petr Yan won his bantamweight interim bantamweight title and we're leaving the octagon in abu Dhabi man, like all the crowd's going crazy, they're reaching over like high fiving and ship and dude, like I just heard one person yell at coves, coves and like I went over in high five and didn't know who it was.

You know, people were recognizing me in the airport stopping me for photographs and things like that. You know, I got back to, I was in India man filming India's Ultimate Warrior with Discovery channel and I got a message once I got back to Thailand saying, oh my God, I can't believe it was you in in India blah blah blah, you're my favorite call me influence. I'm like please don't call me that again. And then like I got back to Thailand and I was sitting in a restaurant man and I saw this dude, like kept looking at me from across the cafe where I was doing some work and I was like, oh man, I wonder if this dude is like going to come and start on me or something um you know, as a former soldier man, like you kind of, you fucking keep an eye on things and you're like alright, this dude's eyeing me up man, like there must be a reason for it, so you kind of like on a little bit of high alert and then the dude gets up and like starts walking over to him, he's looking at me, I'm like, here we go and he comes over and he's like oh you're sean Cobra, and I was like, oh yeah man, he's like introduced himself and like, you know, so I totally understand what you're going through man and how you're feeling. It's it's bizarre for me, you know, like I said as a sniper, you go out, you do your job, you're proud of what you do, but then you sink back into the shadows, No one knows who you are now, you know, people are recognizing me and things like that mate, something it's gonna start happening to you as well man, like as your profile builds um you know, as you go through this process, as you go through this journey particular as you get through um you know, towards the end of it and the media hype starts building and you start pushing out and you've got your pr stuff going on the social media and stuff going on, man, people are gonna start recognizing you?

And um, it's gonna be uh, it's probably gonna be a little bit of a shock to the system if I'm honest. Is that something you've thought about? Yeah, I mean it is, but again, you start to go get a bit egotistical and you know what if it doesn't happen for stop, stop, get ahead of yourself. But I'm pretty sure it will. Um, and you know, quite often I go running and when I'm in the zone, especially when I'm on my own, all these people looking at me and like people look at me and then I got to realize that, oh yeah, it's because I'm like the most, I don't know if you see my term, but I've got this crazy going on Bright Orange guy running around with a four ft flag. Yeah, that's why they're looking at you like you're drawing attention to yourself. You Yeah, yeah. Yeah. That's what I'm here for. But I listened to look into your, all your podcasts. I love listening to what you talk about. Especially when you go into your holistic stuff that you've done before. I'm always listening to that. So as I go around, I'm always, I get a lot of people join me on the run and especially from the armed forces of the r a.

F navy on the, and I'm always always asking me, what do you listen to? You? Can you can you recommend anyone like that, Michael Shawn Kober codes? I'll tell them a bit about you. And in fact, just yesterday I was running with Ferrari F guys and I said, uh, there's a guy called Code, Oh Sean Cobra, The Australian guy. I was like, yeah, yeah, you're hitting all the, even the northeast of uh far north east of England. People will know who you are, mate. So I hear you. That's that's so crazy man. Like that blows my mind, bro. But it's very cool. It's very cool man. And you know, this ties into what we're talking about early mate. Like, you know, kind of, I feel bad for like segue going back towards like some negative stuff with suicide and things like that. But you've had, you've had three mates like commit suicide in the last couple of months since you, since you stepped off. And to me like that means that we're just not reaching enough people, like we're just not getting that message to maybe not enough people, but maybe to the right people.

And you know, hearing that where, you know, people are starting to, you know, hear my name and people know who I am in certain parts of the world, which I never would have thought that I would reach. Like just knowing that like gives me confidence that, you know, we've just got to continue spreading this message, putting these, um, you know, having these types of conversations man that people are going to resonate with, not only resonate with themselves, but then also pass on to their friends and family and people that may have some mental health implications or maybe not even have any issues, but just maybe want to, maybe someone in their life does and they want to try and help them kind of manage their mind and get themselves back on track man. To me, this is why I do this bro, you know, like I said, it's been almost two years since um since I started the podcast and you know, it's been it's been amazing process for me in my own journey of growth and development um but also like knowing that, you know, I'm helping people and I don't do it for the thanks, I don't do it for, you know, the messages that come through, but when those messages do come through man, and I'm like it's sucking, it melts my heart bro.

I'm like, oh man, that makes me so emotional knowing that you know, I may have potentially helped someone um you know, get themselves back on track or helped them help someone that they care for that they love and they care about, you know, manage their mind and get them back on the right track as well, so, you know, have you thought about that for yourself? Like how you're impacting other people that you may not even have met, obviously you're meeting all these people, but then those people that you're meeting, man like they're going and telling other people and Simon said it man, he's like your energy is just so um contagious and that's what it is like dude, that's that's what it is man. Like this is where the environment is so important, right? Like you have the right people around you spreading the right energy, spreading the right message. Like you have no choice but to fall in line with that, otherwise you just fall outside of that circle. Yeah. And I think it's the indirect impact you have without knowing if you can keep keep that knowledge in mind because sometimes you might think, I don't know who I'm helping.

I've spoken to one or two people but that's about it. You know, a couple of people have messaged me this week and you're helping but you also have but that there's such an indirect impact. I mean I listened to you like I listened to your previous podcast and current ones take so much on that. So I've actually taken a lot of lessons from listening to you and now I'm running around the UK 10 all these people about the stuff that I've learned from you. So that's a huge indirect impact and they're now passing it forward, so it's massive and um I do, I get lots of people who come up to me and say, oh paul I heard about you through whatever I've been following you for a while or um I'm with the with the lady yesterday said she came out and she said to say thank you and that her son's taken a lot of away from what I what I've done and it's really helped him but I didn't know that and unless that lady came and told me I would never know, so I think you just got to be safe in the knowledge that if you feel like you're on the right path, if you feel like you're being productive and you're helping people then you probably are, you know, you just don't know how far that impact is has is happening, so you can just do, just do whatever feels right to you and just be safe in the knowledge that there be others, that would appreciate that.

Yeah, yeah. First of all may I appreciate you saying those very, very kind words man. Um and it's the same for me, like anytime I I had had a conversation with The Swiss eight boys yesterday, Adrian and max that episode is going to be live coming monday. Um and then this episode is going to drop the week after and you know, I always love people speaking to people on the same wavelength like that conversation with Simon as well, like that dude that conversation just flowed man and we just went back and forth bounce ideas and for me like I get I learned just as much from you guys man and you know I've I've done a lot of study in um in terms of like um psychology and NLP and behavioral change and um cognitive behavioral therapy and and like you know it's all well and good knowing this information from a textbook. But then when you start having conversations with people like like like I said man I helped speaking writing helps me organize my thoughts and it's the same for most people. So there's there's times where I speak to you and you say blah blah blah and I'm like boom that like it rings a bell in my head and I'm like I've heard this before where ever heard this before and it helps me kind of put together some of the textbook knowledge and then you know give give some like real life application and I can see the cross over there and I'm like all right cool.

Like that helps me understand what you're going through and then I think of something in my life that helps you know or or kind of relates to that and once you can find something that you relate to, it's easier or it's easier to then be able to explain that to other people to be able to help them. So yeah I really appreciate that man and um like I said I learned I learned just as much from my guests as they learn from me and and hopefully these conversations are helping people and, you know, getting out there and, and spreading the right message and um helping people manage their minds and put some little take some tools and techniques and takeaways and actionable steps from these episodes. Um did you listen to you? Obviously listen to the episode with cyanide? Mhm Yeah, Yeah. Fantastic. I mean, I really like listening to you, I said it so I'm not gonna I'm not gonna say anymore because you're you're you're probably starting to get that crunchy. I love listening to say like, he's just such a funny, he's got one of those, those, I don't know, it's something about his voice, you hear it and you just feel, I don't know, a bit secure and warm and you hear him and he's got a great way of talking.

But then listening to the two of you, I just remember being on the run when I listened to your, your your talk and I was up in Scotland on this cliff edges, so it's quite a difficult run and it was pouring down with rain and I was, I was, I was like, this is a bit, it's going to be one of these days, isn't it? And I was like, oh, I know, I know what I can do is just code inside, just on the podcast. I'll put you put the podcast on it and I just, I was just smiling and laughing that blood all the way through my run. It was a fantastic conversation. Very good man. That's really cool dude. You've made me emotional numerous times in this conversation, I got tears in my eyes again. Um there's been an incredible conversation, I know it's your rest day, so I'm gonna let you go so you can go and stretch up and look after the body and you know, look after the mind. Talk to some people make those connections man. Um but I'm absolutely inspired with what you're doing. Um I love seeing stories every every morning of you getting up and you know, spreading your message and then off you go and um yeah, I'm really, I'll really be looking forward to um you know, seeing that story unfold, not just through the next few months, but also, you know the next couple of years and it's definitely something that I want to be involved with being an Ambassador for Swiss Aid, pretty much doing something similar in Australia in a different different model.

You know, I'm looking forward to working together with Head Up and building like a really good brand, really good model that is going to help people um you know, get themselves in a good mindset, continue improving, continue growing, developing um and just help people be better at life man, I love it. I'm looking forward to the collaboration moving forward. It's gonna be, it's gonna be such a great journey, we're already in it and it's come from nothing, I mean, we've we've we had no idea what was gonna happen. How are we going to achieve it? But it was just about putting yourself in that position, being consistent, being persistent, and just seeing what unfolds And we started, we wanted to raise £3 million, or do you want to raise £3 million pounds of this retreat? And there's different avenues you can get that money from. But but we've we only started fundraising since september And we're already over three £150,000. That's how much people want this retreat to happen, you know? It's just getting, it's going to happen now.

We've already got the money in the bank and enough money to to get the first bit of development going. Um and we're not even a year in yet, so the tree is going to happen, and we love the fact that what swiss they do, I'm so happy that we're connected and that we're gonna help each other, and I just think it's the development of everything is just going to get, gonna blow up, it's gonna go way beyond, we can even imagine or comprehend right now. So exciting times to come. Yeah, I agree, mate, you're very inspiring guy paul, I love having a chat with your mate, love your energy, I love your positivity, man, I love everything that you're doing right now. Um and like I said, I'm really looking forward to being a part of the journey moving forward, so much appreciated man, I'll have all of your links in the show notes. Um if there's anything else that you want to send me through to having the show notes, if people want to donate, they want to get in contact, um send that through to me so I can I can put them in. Um but yeah, I love your work brother. Thanks a lot. Covid, thanks for having me on mate, appreciate your time mate. All the best. We'll catch up again soon. Yes, This episode was brought to you by Swiss eight, which is a proactive mental health charity that was designed initially for veterans by veterans that has been pushed out to the wider community.

It is created with veteran lived experience, meaning that a lot of the content creators and contributors, our veterans that have utilized these tools that they're pushing out Putting onto the platform with great success in their own lives. So it's tried, it's true, it's tested. Um the whole goal of Swiss eight is too late to structure and schedule the most important things in your life, build your tribe, structure your routine, create your identity and find your purpose. This episode was also brought to you by my State State is formally known as B spunky. It is a Australian TJ listed nutraceutical, meaning that it is made from all organic compounds, all of the stuff that you need, none of the stuff that you don't. I've been an ambassador for be spunky slash my state for a couple of years now. It is one of those products that I take religiously on a day to day basis. To help me optimize my stress response and my hormone regulation. If you're interested in getting onboard, hit them up. Follow the links in the show notes.

Make sure you type in codes, Ko bes 10 at checkout for your 10% discount. If you found some benefit from this episode, please make sure you share with your friends and family. Anyone you think the message will resonate with. If you share it to your stories, please make sure you tag me so that I can then re share that as well. Any five star ratings and reviews are much appreciated Guys always help me help me bump up the ratings, allows more eyes to get onto the podcast, more ears to start listening to the message, which then also creates more awareness and allows me to attract bigger names, bigger guests for your listening pleasure. Much love Guys, Peace

"Why I'm running 5000 miles around the UK" - Paul Minter of Head-Up Charity
"Why I'm running 5000 miles around the UK" - Paul Minter of Head-Up Charity
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